[00:00:00] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Hello Nikki. Welcome to the show.
[00:00:14] Nikki Closser: Hi Scott. Thank you so much for having me.
[00:00:17] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. Yeah. I, I love, I love when we get to trade guests for each other's shows. It's always a lot of fun because I know, you know, when I'm on, when I was on yours, you asked me a bunch of questions that,I was not expecting. And, it, now it's my turn to ask you questions
[00:00:35] and it's always fun to, to trade off.
[00:00:38] Nikki Closser: I know it's always good to collaborate. You know, it's like this industry is such a great one, and we can all work together and lift each other up. It just makes such a difference.
[00:00:46] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah, a
[00:00:47] hundred percent.
[00:00:48] Nikki Closser: hopefully I'll be okay as a guest. I'm so used to being interviewer, so we'll see.
[00:00:52] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: yeah, you'll be great. You'll be great. so the first question I ask every single guest is,
[00:00:57] What is one thing that you do for the photographic process that has saved you time?
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[00:00:57] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: what is one thing you do during the [00:01:00] photographic process behind the camera that saves you time?
[00:01:04] Nikki Closser: Oh man, you know what? Nailing down specific poses has been huge for me. Huge. When I was first starting out and I didn't really know how to pose and I, I'm not a lifestyle photography. I'm not trying to get candid photos, so I know it's a little bit different if. You know, someone's going into it more of a free flow.
[00:01:24] But for, for what I do having, I have 13 poses that I have like perfected for every, everyone who walks into my studio, most people who walk into my studio, I can utilize those 13 poses. And when I'm super confident and I know what to do and what I'm gonna do next, it puts my clients at ease. So it makes them, Relaxed. It makes the shoot flow a lot quicker. They trust me, they see how confident I am. So just being able to go, you know, from pose to pose helps in in so many different ways. Definitely. I.
[00:01:57] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: So, so two questions following that. The first is, are you [00:02:00] doing all 13 for every client?
[00:02:03] Nikki Closser: I mean, pretty much, especially in the personal branding. If I'm in my studio where I have the setups that I'm using on a day-to-day basis, then yes, it's. And, and a lot of those poses, I'm doing multiple times with either a different outfit, a different backdrop, a different expression, to mix it up so that it's not, these clients aren't looking at these, their photos to choose which ones they wanna purchase and they all look identical.
[00:02:31] Like I'm mixing it up with composition expression, you know, different tweaks to the pose to make it a little bit different. So that, you know, 'cause variety. I find that shooting with a lot of variety. I sell more. Mm-Hmm
[00:02:45] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: yeah. on the flip side of this, so you did say, you know, because you're using very familiar poses, you know, it kind of, it presents this, this confidence to the client, right? 'cause you're, it's so familiar to [00:03:00] you. How often do you experiment with something that is new for you?and how does that go when you do it?
[00:03:07] Nikki Closser: Yeah, that's a, okay. I love this question because typically the way I start my shoots is with doing the things that I know the client hired me for in the first place. And usually that includes those specific poses. Once I kind of, I know that I've nailed, I. The shoot with what they hired me for and you know, I got what I typically get.
[00:03:27] That's when I start to get creative and outside of the box. And it depends on the client's personality, what their brand is, you know, how colorful they are, or if they're just more subdued, that's when I will start to kind of go nuts and do more of the outside of the box poses. And I usually save that towards the end.
[00:03:46] Again, once I know what I've gotten or I've gotten what I needed. What they need. And then also they're having so much fun and they're so comfortable at that point that that's when I really like to get like crazy with it.
[00:03:59] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: [00:04:00] When, when you do try something new, do you, do you verbalize that to the client saying like, Hey, I'm gonna try something I've never tried before. Or, or do you just do it and
[00:04:07] they, they have no idea.
[00:04:10] Nikki Closser: not, I don't normally verbalize it. 'cause I don't want them to start to feel any sort of anxiety like, oh gosh, what's she gonna do with me? Or anything like that. So I don't think I'd necessarily verbalize it unless I'm trying like a new lighting setup or a different backdrop that I've never used or something like that.
[00:04:26] I'll say, bear with me. I'm just gonna get, you know, make sure, I really wanna make sure I nail this for you. So I'm gonna try a few different things and we're gonna see what looks best. Like, I'm not afraid to tell the clients, Hey, I'm gonna try a couple different things just to make sure you know, you look your best and the lighting is the most flattering for you and that sort of thing.
[00:04:46] If I say that I feel like they're not, like, what is she doing? Am I not doing the pose right? Am I not doing what I'm supposed to do? I, I want them to know it's on me and not on them.
[00:04:57] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: right?
[00:04:57] Nikki Closser: Yeah. So that's when I'll verbalize it.[00:05:00]
[00:05:00] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Nice. Nice. let's, let's move into the business side for a second. so, you know, very often on this show we talk weddings,
[00:05:10] and I love when I get to have somebody who's not a wedding photographer come on because, you know, it's, it's quite often enlightening to learn a business practice or something that, that a business win or whatever it might be that,That you're not used to, you may not think about normally. Right.
[00:05:27] so
[00:05:28] What is one thing that you do for the business that saves you time or money?
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[00:05:28] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: what is one thing that you do for your business that saves you time or money?
[00:05:35] Nikki Closser: For the record, I did shoot weddings for five years. So, so I did have that under my belt before I realized I, it just wasn't efficient enough for me. I was spending too much time shooting, editing, interacting with clients. The really long days like that, I'm just, I'm, I. My motto for, for myself and my business is efficiency.
[00:05:56] Without lacking the service and producing the [00:06:00] images that I wanna put my name on, that I know my clients will love. So when it comes to the business side, I do, oh gosh. Okay. I do. Online digital reveals, so I guess quote unquote in person. So I share my screen with them. I do a photo viewing with a slideshow.
[00:06:22] I put together a beautiful slideshow with music. We go through the photos that way I'm not someone who's just gonna send out the gallery and say, make your choices and hope they get back to me. I wanna get paid, I wanna get them their images, and I wanna make it as easy for them as possible. So we schedule their photo viewing.
[00:06:38] Within two weeks, usually 10 days after their photo shoot, and we're doing it together so that they're, they're either making the decisions right then and there on their own, or I'm giving them their advice. They're paying me, and then I'm delivering the images right away. There's no chasing the client down.
[00:06:53] There's no, you know, oh God. I just, I remember those days when I used to just send out galleries and it was like, did they [00:07:00] look at 'em? Are they gonna, you know. And I will say I do things based on packages. I don't do shoots where it's like, okay, you pay me one fee and I give you all of the images. So just for reference there.
[00:07:11] So that makes sense to people. So I have small, medium, and large packages, or they can purchase more in addition to that. So if back in the day when I would just like send out a gallery, I mean, people are busy. It's not that they didn't wanna buy the photos. But when you can schedule it and make it super simple for them and they know they're not gonna see their photos until they do this viewing with you and they purchase them and everything.
[00:07:35] For me, that cut down on so much time.
[00:07:39] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: When, and so,how, how often is it that. That you get. I think you asked me the similar question.
[00:07:48] How often is it that you have your clients that, you know, they come in, they purchase this package, but then during this, virtual in-person sales call, they're buying more than what they originally [00:08:00] anticipated.
[00:08:00] Nikki Closser: Oh, that hap? Yeah. Oh yeah. That happens quite a bit like, because my packages are five, 10, and 20 images. And again, most of this is for personal branding and I do this for seniors, seniors as well. But the majority of what I do is, is personal branding. And some people will say, I just need one. I just need one headshot.
[00:08:17] Then I, I go through and explain to them why it makes sense for them to have more than one. And I have my whole like, list of, of things of, you know, to sell them that package. And I'm like, listen, my smallest package is five photos. There's no pressure. If you end up with that five photos, great. But more often than not, because I have photographed them with a ton of variety, I, I do six outfits in 60 minutes.
[00:08:41] and most of the time some people it's, I can't quite get there, but I would say like 80% of the time I'm doing six outfits in, in 60 minutes or less. And so they've got six outfits with different backdrops, expressions and composition and everything. It's really difficult for them to walk away with five, so the [00:09:00] majority, it's very rare that I, I sell just that, that five package.
[00:09:04] Yeah.
[00:09:05] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Nice, nice. it's just funny that, so I, I still do head shots here and there when, when. When I can. and I'm very close to a beautiful, it's a, it's a government owned land, but it's like an open park there. It's actually like, just grass and farm and stuff that nothing can happen there. And there's this old, building that. Was from the Revolutionary War that still stands and they
[00:09:33] maintain it and whatnot. And I use that as a backdrop quite often. and I'm very close to it. I could literally walk to it if I wanted to, but when I have a client and I do a headshot here in the studio, I, we then drive over there and do some outside stuff, even though they only want the studio because it's so close.
[00:09:50] And more often than not, they want the outside stuff in addition to
[00:09:54] the, to, to the what they originally, you know, were paying me to do. So,
[00:09:58] It's, yeah, it's a, it's a big win [00:10:00] when, when that happens for sure.
[00:10:01] Nikki Closser: Yeah. Yeah, it's, you bring up such a good point. 'cause sometimes people don't know what they want unless you show them. What is possible. So, yeah, I, I like to do that too. There it is. More often than not, I will head outside for a little, you know, just an outfit or two, and again, variety cells,
[00:10:20] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: yeah.
[00:10:20] It really does. Yeah. They may not think they need it now, but they might need it four months from now or whatever, and. and.
[00:10:27] they'll, then they have it.
[00:10:28] Nikki Closser: and, and not even the needing part, but if they look amazing in it. They're not gonna say no to that. So as long as you're lighting them well and, and they're really flattering and, and they like how they look in them, people have a really hard time saying no to that. So.
[00:10:41] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah.I got, so I was not planning this question, but I was just, just thinking about it. When it comes to personal branding,
[00:10:49] Licensing Photos for Personal Brand Photography
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[00:10:49] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: what is your licensing like? Is that. Is it included? Like they can just use it for what they need when they buy it, or do you have to, do they have to purchase that additionally?
[00:10:59] How does that [00:11:00] work with your, with your business?
[00:11:02] Nikki Closser: You know, I'm probably not the best person to, to respond to this 'cause I'm sure I'm leaving money on the table with license, with licensing. But most of my clients are coming in specifically for their website, their social media, their LinkedIn, they're, you know, in a photo for an article or you know, a company headshot, things like that.
[00:11:21] So typically I don't do anything like that. as far as additional licensing with, you know, like most of my clients are not gonna then put their photo in an ad for like, you know, a big company or billboard or anything like that. I, I guess I have had some real estate agents on Billboard, but no, it's not something that I've done at this point.
[00:11:45] I think if I was getting like a ton of authors or like people who I don't, yeah, it's just not something I've done.
[00:11:51] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Mm-Hmm. I think like, for me, what I, what I would be doing, personally would be having it so like the social aspect [00:12:00] is included, but if they did want to use it for a major, you know, state. Ad, or national ad or international, then they have to come and get a different license on top
[00:12:11] Nikki Closser: Yeah, I do. Yeah. Sorry, did I just interrupt you? Okay.
[00:12:15] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: no, no, it's all good.
[00:12:16] Go ahead.
[00:12:16] Nikki Closser: I, I, I do have to say I, I price my, my shoots so that I'm happy with the income that I'm making from
[00:12:22] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Mm-Hmm.
[00:12:23] Nikki Closser: So, you know, I have an average sale of $2,000 per personal branding shoot, and I'm happy with that. You know, I feel like if I, if I was charging less than that, you know, or giving away the farm or something, I think I might consider doing licensing.
[00:12:38] more, I guess I just haven't felt the need to go there yet. I don't know. So
[00:12:44] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: It's all good.
[00:12:45] Nikki Closser: where my brain is.
[00:12:47] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. No, I mean, it, there's so many, there's so much potential, so many different ways that you could go with it, that
[00:12:53] if if the opportunity arose that you, that you needed to think about that, you know? The possibilities around endless of where you can [00:13:00] go.
[00:13:00] so at, so I'd Imagen, we, we do AI photo editing and AI culling.so I'm wondering whether it's, with Imagen or not, does it make a difference?
[00:13:11] What is one thing that you do for editing that has saved you time?
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[00:13:11] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: What is one thing you do for the editing that saves you time?
[00:13:16] Nikki Closser: I have, I, again, I'm, I, I almost shouldn't even admit this out loud, but I'm not a super techie person. So I know that Imagen, and it has so many incredible programs out there that I'm not utilizing yet, that I really should, I, I really should, but I'm kind of like an old curmudgeon. Like I'm set in my ways where I do, I do have a preset that I've made that in Lightroom that I use on 99% of my images, and that is just as, as soon as I've called my images.
[00:13:46] Every photo that is applied to within Lightroom, and it's just more of a color tone sort of situation. It just gives a little bit of a pop. And I do that automatically, and that saves me a lot of time with having to adjust color tones individually. the other [00:14:00] thing I do is just, it's batch editing. So if I'm gonna be brightening eyes, for example, I will do that on one image and then I just sync it all in Lightroom.
[00:14:10] I used to go through and hand brighten every single eyeball in Photoshop, and then I realized that was really, really dumb and unefficient inefficient. So yeah, the syncing and batch editing in Lightroom has been really, really important for me.
[00:14:28] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Good. Good. Yeah, I'm glad that that works. That works well for you. I think part of the reason why it does is, and I, I'm assuming here, but, so maybe I shouldn't assume, but, I think that part of the reason why that does work well for you is because more often than not, you are in the studio environment where you control. Every aspect of the light
[00:14:46] and, and, and what there's not that, potential of something impacting it. So you get the consistency in camera automatically, which makes doing the batch thinking in Lightroom, a little bit, a little bit more [00:15:00] reliable than it
[00:15:00] Nikki Closser: Yeah. Well, and I will say if, when I am shooting outside, like, you know, in the summer, I usually do, you know, maybe 10 to 12 high school senior photo shoots, and I'll do it by.section. So like if I'm taking them downtown Chelsea, where I live in the little alleyway, I will sink that segment of photo, you know, that batch of photos, and then move on to the next one, adjust it, and then sink that one.
[00:15:24] So if I, you know, I do most of my outdoor shoots in my, on my property at home. I live out in the country and I have wild flowers and all the things, and so I will sink those photos separately than the ones that I did like downtown, for example. Yeah.
[00:15:40] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: someone in a previous episode, I can't think of who it was off the top of my head, but somebody brought up that exact thing of like, doing it in batches
[00:15:48] in a certain way, but they, they sort. So this, I believe this was weddings and they sort it by the prom, like predominant color in the scene, in a batch of photos.
[00:15:59] So if [00:16:00] they see there's a, you know, some woman at, in the wedding that's wearing this bright red dress, they're gonna put all of that photos with that woman
[00:16:08] in the together so they can edit the same for the, for
[00:16:12] colors. Very interesting. Yeah.
[00:16:14] Nikki Closser: Well, that makes sense. 'cause when I'm shooting outside with gra, like all green grass, I'm just like, ugh. Like I would rather shoot when all the grass is dead. Like, okay, gra like all the foliage. For example, on my property, I love shooting in the winter and fall because it's muted color tones and it's not just like bright green that's taking over the image and just making your colors kind of wonky.
[00:16:35] And so, yeah, I don't know. I'm like a dead. A dead foliage lover or shooting in the desert where there's muted tones. Yeah.
[00:16:44] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. Yeah. okay, so, so you, you just photographed a, a realtor, for example, right? You just did their, their branding photos. Now,
[00:16:56] What is one thing that you do after a session that has increased business?
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[00:16:56] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: what is one thing you do after the session that [00:17:00] increases business?
[00:17:02] Nikki Closser: Okay. So for me in-person networking. Has been crucial, absolutely crucial to getting clients.
[00:17:10] And I know you said after what I would do after, but a lot of what I have done for my marketing happens kind of before. So if I can just quickly say what I do before and then I'll get to what I would do after. Built like building connections and relationships for me has been so important. And I know sometimes people hear that, like network working meetings great.
[00:17:31] You know. And I felt like that too. Like there were days when I was pulling up in my minivan to go to one of these networking groups like, oh my God, I do not wanna go. But I never regretted going. I would regret if I didn't go, because I always made some type of connection. Maybe I wasn't booking 10 shoots during that specific meeting.
[00:17:47] But when you can find a group that you resonate with and you are consistently showing up, you're building relationships and you know, eventually. Giving your amazing pitch that you've memorized and that [00:18:00] really people will remember. That's so, so, so important to have a pitch that grabs people's attention and that people will remember you and then you show them your beautiful work eventually and consistently going to these networking meetings like that has been, that changed my world, changed my business, and got me, I swear, got me where to where I am today for sure.
[00:18:24] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I, you know, I think it was. During the pandemic, when I saw like a rise of LinkedIn business networking groups where they started having regular Zoom calls,
[00:18:36] did, did, did that start becoming a thing for you as well? Was the virtual ones in addition to the in person
[00:18:43] Nikki Closser: Yeah. You know. Okay. So it's interesting because I put in the work in these networking groups and, and I will say there are groups out there where you have to meet a certain, there's like requirements. You have to be there, a certain number of meetings. you have to do a certain number of like one-on-one interactions and refer a [00:19:00] certain number of people.
[00:19:00] Like I don't like to be told what to do. That's not for me. Like I preferred groups that were more relaxed and just more kind of relationship building. And if I refer you, it's because I want to. So I will say to people listening, like there are different types of groups out there and it's just finding the one that works for your personality.
[00:19:17] 'cause some people love the stringent, you know, the rules, the strictness of it all, just not for me. So back when I first started this business in 2012, 2012 through like 2019, gosh. I, well, maybe it was like 2013 through, through 2019 is when I was really doing my networking and I would say there was a three year period in there from like 2013 to 2016 where I was doing this consistently.
[00:19:45] It got to the point where I didn't even really need to go to meetings anymore because I had built up my name so much that the referrals, even today, I, 'cause I lived in Seattle for 11 years, so I, I built my business in Seattle. I'm in Michigan now. And [00:20:00] I still, from meetings that I went to in like 20 13, 20 14, I'm getting referrals from these Seattle folks.
[00:20:07] Like it's wild. And then when I moved back to Michigan, I started doing the meetings here again. Okay. All of that to say that when the pandemic hit, I wasn't really doing a whole lot of meetings 'cause I, the referrals were still like, I just didn't need to anymore. Like when you put the work in. know, for a, for a while there, eventually you just kind of have to like grease the wheel.
[00:20:30] that's what I was doing during that time. so I was still getting the referrals without having to go to the meetings. I did attend a few of the virtual networking meetings that were here in Michigan. but I just hadn't, I didn't need to as much anymore. If that makes sense. Like if I had just started networking during that time, I would've a hundred percent been doing all of those virtual meetings, but I still had referrals coming in, so I didn't feel a whole, you know, need to,
[00:20:54] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I, I love that. Like, you know, all this, all this effort basically makes [00:21:00] it easier for you to get those referrals. 'cause we all know that referrals are, are one of
[00:21:05] the best wa ways to get business, right? So I love the fact that all the work you put in for many years, made it so that you are, you have to do far less work now to
[00:21:15] get those referrals.
[00:21:16] Nikki Closser: it's so true. It's so true. And, and that leads me to what the, what I do after I have a shoot. We're so lucky that we're in an industry where we, it's so visual, you know, if someone posts their photos and tags me in it, their colleagues and their friends are gonna see, and they're like, oh, who's your photographer?
[00:21:34] So that's something that I ask people to do. Well, first of all, I always ask, is it okay if I share your photos on social media? And you know, I've very, maybe one or one or two times has someone said no to me over the last, you know, 12 years. But when I do that, I also say, you know, if you do share it, would you mind just tagging me so that people know.
[00:21:57] You know that I did the work and they always, oh my gosh, of [00:22:00] course. You know, and some people will scream from the rooftops about me, which is great, and then I'll share that. So that's something that I always do, you know, afterwards, just to try and keep that excitement going about the, about their photos.
[00:22:13] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: It's great. Yeah. It's, I, you know, I feel like, There's a, there's a handful of genres where the impact of a tag can be
[00:22:22] great, right? One being weddings for sure,
[00:22:25] because it's the largest industry in the world.
[00:22:29] Weddings and death, the largest industries,
[00:22:31] Right.
[00:22:31] and, and another being anything related to businesses, right?
[00:22:36] So whether it's just head shots or whether it's branding photos, you know, there's. There's a whole social network designed just for that, just for business. So,
[00:22:46] Nikki Closser: It's so true. It's so true. I mean, both online and going back to in person. feel like we're in, in like a point in the world where so many people are, are ready to kind of quit their nine to [00:23:00] five and are becoming entrepreneurs and doing, you know, more small business type things where they're trying to grow their business too, which means they're going to these networking meetings.
[00:23:10] So it's the perfect. You know, perfect storm of getting clients because every, any person who's in business, whether it's for themselves or whatever, they need photos. So it's an easy sell. And like I have networking meetings like nailed and like I have a personal branding course and I go through the whole thing.
[00:23:26] 'cause it's just been something, it, it's like not as hard and daunting as it needs to be. It really can be super, super easy if you like, you know, follow certain steps that there's like a recipe to it. But yeah, people with business, they need photos. It's an easy sell.
[00:23:44] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah.
[00:23:45] Nikki Closser: Yeah.
[00:23:46] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: this is my favorite part of the show. I got two decks here.
[00:23:49] Nikki Closser: Oh boy.
[00:23:50] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Pick a color.
[00:23:52] Nikki Closser: orange.
[00:23:53] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Okay. I am going to shuffle through this. Just tell me when [00:24:00] to stop.
[00:24:00] Nikki Closser: Okay.
[00:24:04] Stop.
[00:24:05] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Okay. My next question that you just picked randomly, what is your typical Friday, Friday night look like?
[00:24:16] Nikki Closser: Oh gosh. Okay. in the summertime it is, me and my husband and my kids go to our cottage every weekend and we are usually, Either out on the boat or making s'mores, hanging out with our friends at the lake. We have such a great like friend community out there, just like family bonding time. That is absolutely what we do.
[00:24:38] That's my, like, that's my happy place out at our cottage on the lake out in the winter. I don't know. I'm kind of a homebody. I'm like, I wanna be at home.
[00:24:49] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: You're also in a very cold state in the winter.
[00:24:53] Nikki Closser: it blows, but whatever. It's home. It's home. So yeah, I'm a bit of a homebody. I do [00:25:00] love going out to eat. I'm a bit of a foodie.
[00:25:02] but spending time with my kids and my husband and my girlfriends, that's probably my, my ideal Friday night.
[00:25:12] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Very nice. I am also a homebody, so I, and I like to go. I, I don't consider myself a foodie, but I like to try new places
[00:25:22] for sure. even if I get the same thing, I would get somewhere else. I like to see if somebody does it better,
[00:25:28] Nikki Closser: Yeah, yeah. Well before, so when I was in college, I, I actually graduated with a an MSW, so I was a social worker before I was a photographer, and I got so burned out and that's when I ended up making the switch. But for those like eight years that I was in undergrad and grad school, I waited tables and.
[00:25:44] Fortunately, for a couple years I worked with a chef who changed my life when it came to food. I mean, I had no idea what I was missing until I worked with him. So that really opened my eyes to different restaurants and different food, and
[00:25:55] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: That's awesome. Yeah.so I want you to look [00:26:00] at your business from a 30,000 foot view down.
[00:26:03] Nikki Closser: Ooh. Okay.
[00:26:05] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Can you share, this gets deep.
[00:26:07] Can you share an outlined breakdown of your workflow from lead to delivery?
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[00:26:07] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Can you share an outline, breakdown of your workflow from lead to delivery, like the, not all the juicy details, but like an overall summary of like, here's what happens when the lead comes in and to delivery.
[00:26:20] Nikki Closser: Yep. Okay. Lead comes in, I have email templates, so it depends on. What they're asking for. But I have all my different email templates and I, you know, I personalize it, but for the most part it's templated ready to go. I send that out with my PDF and my pricing and I make sure that my, okay. I know you said not a lot of details.
[00:26:37] I'm a talker, so
[00:26:37] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: You could share as much or as little as you want. I, you know, it's up to you.
[00:26:41] Nikki Closser: my PDF is very visual, so I have some before and after photos in there. I have pictures of the studio. I have pictures of them getting their hair and makeup done. you know, lots of diversity in there. Just really. Showing the process and what that looks like. And then at the end, I have my pricing with all of my packages and I send that out [00:27:00] and I, you know, do follow up if I don't hear back from them right away.
[00:27:04] Once they book that is when, you know, we, I, I do somewhat of a consultation, usually just through email about what is it that they're looking for to get outta their photos. do they have a website, do they have branding colors? That sort of thing, so that I have things prepared as far as backdrops and whatever.
[00:27:21] They come in, we do the shoot, and after that, you know, upload the photos, call them. I do have a retouch her. She does basic things for me, such as hair, flyaways, any blemishes on the skin. If the, some of my backdrops are so beat up, so she will touch up those if needed. She sends them back to me. I just.
[00:27:40] Give 'em a once over making sure that everything looks how I want it to. And then we do the photo viewing and from there they choose their photos and like I said, we do the slideshow and all of that and then I get paid and they get their images and that's kind of the kind of the overview.
[00:27:58] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: so your, I got a handful of questions [00:28:00] with that.
[00:28:00] The, which by the way, you said you're a talker. That was probably the fastest of anybody's ever done that, so
[00:28:05] Nikki Closser: I mean, I could give you more, but I wasn't
[00:28:08] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. No, it's good. It was, it was great. so the templates, they're fully manual. They're, they're not automated.
[00:28:15] You just, you have
[00:28:15] the templates you drop
[00:28:18] Nikki Closser: Yeah, I, again, I'm like one of those pe these people where I get overwhelmed really easily by a lot of details, and so I've, I've tried and looked at different CRMs, but. The setup of it is so overwhelming to me that I've just never pulled the trigger, which again, I know it's probably, I probably should, but I just use Google, or sorry, Gmail email templates.
[00:28:38] So I have my
[email protected] email address hooked up to my Gmail, and all of my email templates are in there, so I get real specific. I'm not just like, oh, here's my pricing. Thanks for reaching out. Like I'm, I'm, I mention things that I do, for example. I will pose you and direct you the entire time, so you do not need [00:29:00] to know what to do.
[00:29:01] I love photographing people who are uncomfortable in front of the camera. So if you don't like having your, having your photo taken, I'm your girl. things like that really get people interested. I say we're gonna do your hair and makeup. My stylist will do your hair and makeup, how you want to look, and I'm so excited to photograph you.
[00:29:17] you know, all the pricing information is attached and let me know if you have any questions. Like I try to. You, you know, give them the details of things to get them really excited. So, but anyways, yes, Gmail, I just use the templates that way. So I'll have, prep, shoot prep, you know, once they book, I send over the list of what to bring and all of that.
[00:29:42] And then follow up scheduling their photo viewing. All of it's templated. Yeah.
[00:29:46] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: And so you don't have any CRM in place to like track the progress of the leads that come into when they book or anything? You don't use anything. You just,
[00:29:55] just, everything's a.
[00:29:56] Nikki Closser: you
[00:29:57] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: No, no, it's
[00:29:59] Nikki Closser: [00:30:00] but no, I don't.
[00:30:01] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: okay because
[00:30:02] originally I used to use, just like a Gmail label and I would switch the label in Gmail. 'cause I don't, I don't do such high volume where I need a CRM. but now I actually use, and I, I talked about this in episode 42.I use Apple Reminders and they have a Kanban view in the
[00:30:20] Nikki Closser: reminder. So I make a new reminder. For the lead, and then I just move the, the person's name depending on where they are in my process. yeah, that sounds awesome.
[00:30:30] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: yeah. second question, and you, you just mentioned your makeup artist, your stylist. Do you use the same person each every time?
[00:30:37] Nikki Closser: For the most part, yes, there are times when she's not available. So I do have some backups. when I lived in Seattle, I studio rent out there was extremely expensive. And so I shared with a makeup artist and I. Then when she could, she didn't share anymore. She was moving, I had another makeup artist in there and we just shared the studio cost, which was great.
[00:30:56] So I would typically use her, the, speaking of efficiency, the, the [00:31:00] girl that I use in Michigan, her name's Megan Simmons, she's very good and she's very fast. So if it's, if it's takes her over an hour to do hair and makeup. The person must have like a mane of hair that is, you know, but she's usually done with hair and makeup in 45 minutes or less.
[00:31:16] And then my shoots usually take, like I said, 60 min, 60 outfit or 60 outfits. Oh my gosh. Six outfits in 60 minutes. So typically I'm in and out of there in two hours. Hair and makeup and shoot.
[00:31:29] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: mm-Hmm.
[00:31:30] Nikki Closser: Yeah.
[00:31:32] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Also on the makeup topic, and this is kind of like, it's a serious question, but I'm also just curious at the same time, how often, if you had to give like a percentage, how often do your male client want makeup done? Because like for me, if I was having it done, I would probably say, if you think I need makeup for the photos, or if you think I need makeup to.like I've got these like birthmarks here that drive me insane. like I would [00:32:00] want them covered up potentially.
[00:32:01] Right. How often, if you think of a percentage, how often do the men want their makeup done?
[00:32:06] Nikki Closser: pretty much never. the only time I can think of is when every year I photograph 300, graduating dental students from two universities here in Michigan, and Megan comes with me and she'll do just because it helps me with retouching. more quickly, like any shine. on the skin and things like that.
[00:32:28] She'll do touches touchups like that, but I, I offer it, but usually, usually never.
[00:32:33] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Interesting.
[00:32:34] That's interesting. okay, so, we're, we're at the end here and, basically two final questions. One is for everybody who's listening to workflows, tell 'em about the podcast that you host.
[00:32:47] Nikki Closser: Oh yeah. I host the, the Portrait System podcast, and I basically interview people about their business, how they started all the way to where they're at now. They talk about the things that have been [00:33:00] really hard for them and how they've overcome them, how they. You know, have this great sales average or how they're working up to a better sales average.
[00:33:07] People from all over the world, all different types of photographers. It's really inspiring and it's really fun and it's been so cool. Like, Scott, we got to connect that way. Like it's, it's just so cool to be able to talk to people from around the world. I mean all over Europe, parts of Africa, all over the United States, Canada, It's been really, really cool to connect with so many people, and everyone always gives like so much inspiration and so many golden nuggets of what people can do in their business and to not burn out. You know, like, you know, we're not a podcast where we're talking about, oh, you know, do a $500 photo shoot and then you're gonna survive on that.
[00:33:49] Like we really. Hone in on getting your prices up to, industry standard so that we can set across the board so that none of us burn out. So there we're not working for minimum [00:34:00] wage, you know? So yeah, that's kind of the gist of it. It started with Sue, with Sue Bryce. She was the one who initially asked me to host it, and so Sue was a big, a, a big part of, you know, just her self value stuff and, you know, we talk a lot about that and so, yeah, it's been great.
[00:34:17] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Awesome.
[00:34:17] Yep. So if, if you're listening to workflows and you're looking for another, another podcast and you're not already subscribe to the portrait system, if you're sure to be sure to head over there,
[00:34:25] we'll have the link in the show notes for sure.
[00:34:27] and Nikki.
[00:34:28] Nikki Closser: mentioning that. I appreciate it.
[00:34:30] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. And, and where can listeners learn more about you, specifically connect with you and of course, see your incredible branding photos.
[00:34:39] Nikki Closser: yeah, Instagram is my jam. I love Instagram. It's just my name, Nikki Closser, and my website is nikki closser.com. So that's where I am most of the time. Yeah.
[00:34:50] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: perfect. Thank you so much for, for chatting. I know, speaking of golden nuggets and all that, I know there was a lot in here that, you know, people will be able to, to, to, to get from and, [00:35:00] and hopefully make some changes or simplify in their businesses if they're still on the fence with, with certain technology and stuff.
[00:35:09] So
[00:35:09] Nikki Closser: and I mean personal branding, that has been my bread and butter for the last decade. So if anyone has questions about personal branding too, feel free to reach out.yeah, happy to answer questions.
[00:35:19] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Thank you so much.
[00:35:20] Nikki Closser: Cool. Thanks Scott.
