Mastering Compassion in Photography and Business

[00:00:00] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Debbie-jean Lemonte is an extraordinary photographer and a passionate artist dedicated to transforming fleeting moments into lasting [00:01:00] memories. As a black Caribbean Jamaican queer woman, Debbie-jean navigates the industry with a courage and determination, breaking barriers and challenging norms, her art inspires others to embrace their uniqueness wholeheartedly. [00:01:14] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Believing that love knows no bounds. She proudly serves couples and families of all identities and backgrounds. Her work has been featured in Brides, Pop Sugar, the New York Post, buzzfeed, vanity Fair. The list can go on. I'm very excited about this conversation. Debbie has so much to offer and so much fantastic, knowledge to share with you. [00:01:39] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: So tune in. Here we go with my conversation With Debbie-jean Lemonte. [00:01:46] [00:01:48] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Hey, Debbie, how's it going? [00:01:50] Debbiejean Lemonte: it is going well. How are you? [00:01:52] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I'm doing all right. It's, it's not too often that I get to speak to a guest that is in my same time zone. And not [00:02:00] only that, but you're. You're one hour north of me, so we're in the same state. it's, it's a rare treat that this gets to happen on the Workflows Photography podcast. [00:02:11] Debbiejean Lemonte: yay. [00:02:12] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: yeah. So we're gonna, we're gonna kick this off right away with, a very important topic that I feel needs to be discussed more in the photo industry. [00:02:22] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: And that is [00:02:23] How do we make our photography businesses more inclusive? --- [00:02:23] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: how do we as, as photographers with our businesses. be more inclusive, right in, in, the guests that are at events that we might be photographing or the clients acce,you know, themselves that we are either trying to attract or trying to book or, how do we, just make, how do we, what's like one good tip that you might have to make our photography businesses more inclusive all around. [00:02:51] Debbiejean Lemonte: I would say, honestly speaking, I can't even give one good advice. I think I have 5 million, but [00:02:57] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I'm sure you do. [00:02:58] Debbiejean Lemonte: I say honestly, step out [00:03:00] of your group.a lot of folks stay within their frame, and we were talking about this earlier, like, like for yourself as a white man, what does your photography group look like? What does your vendor group look like depending on what you photograph, right? [00:03:15] Debbiejean Lemonte: So that's what you're gonna keep photographing. Whatever that shows up in your group, once you step outside of that and give, I guess, space. for other peoples, to people to step in and say, Hey, we would love to have you. However, we notice that your portfolio doesn't have X, Y, Z. That's the moment where you show yourself to be an ally. [00:03:34] Debbiejean Lemonte: You say, Hey, you could keep it honest. Like for me, I may be queer, but to be honest, if you look at my portfolio, I don't have a lot of queer people. And it took a while for me to realize queer people aren't booking me, not because. I am, you know, queer myself. It's like they're not booking me because they don't see the representation in my portfolio. [00:03:57] Debbiejean Lemonte: So I took the time and I made [00:04:00] sure I wasn't tokenizing as well, where I set up sessions, free sessions, or discounted sessions with either queer couples or queer people themselves, trans people, non-binary people, and. I ask them like, Hey, you have this moment coming up. Do you mind if I photograph you? And in that moment, I even give them the option. [00:04:21] Debbiejean Lemonte: You could say yes to your photos being used publicly, or you could say, no. Either way, I'm going to photo photograph you.the reason being is like, also if you don't want me to put it on the website, you might give me the permission to use it on the backend. So if someone does reach out to me, I could say, Hey, while these photos may not be on my website, I do have this person's permission to share it on the backend with someone who might be interested. [00:04:45] Debbiejean Lemonte: So step out of your. Comfort zone. Step out of your, your little circle and introduce yourself to new people who don't share your thoughts, who don't share your experiences. And I, I'm sure you'll find the client that you're looking [00:05:00] for or even you want to like diversify your portfolio with, and some of them are pretty helpful. [00:05:05] Debbiejean Lemonte: They're not, they're not gonna be a pain in the butt. They're gonna be helpful. [00:05:09] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: You know, in a way, obviously a very different thing, but in a way, it's a similar approach to how do you sell more, sell more wall art? Well, you gotta show wall art for people to know that you're selling wall art. So in, in a way, it's a very similar. Show what you want to attract, and surround yourself by that. [00:05:31] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: That I love it. I love it. fantastic. so let's, let's dive into the typical first question I ask every guest, which is, [00:05:40] What is one thing that you do for the photographic process that has saved you time? --- [00:05:40] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: what is one thing you do for the photographic process? You're behind the camera, that, saves you time in your workflow overall? [00:05:49] Debbiejean Lemonte: As my, I call him my first mentor, Jimmy Sweet. when I first picked up a camera, the first advice he ever gave me was, get it right, or at least close to perfect in [00:06:00] camera. So when it is time to do post-production or editing, it saves you time. So I work with clients all the time, and if I, I don't care if it's a strand of here in the middle of your forehead, I am taking the time to move that to the side. [00:06:15] Debbiejean Lemonte: Why? Because it's saving me 20 minutes in Photoshop. [00:06:18] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. [00:06:19] Debbiejean Lemonte: So when it comes to the concept, if I'm behind the camera, I'm going to guide you, but I'm also going to fix you up. Get it right in camera, as close to perfect [00:06:29] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: how often are you missing that in camera and are you beating yourself up for it? [00:06:34] Debbiejean Lemonte: look there. Literally the other day I did a graduation session and I'm in the zone. We're having fun, like I like to connect with my clients and we're in it and we're getting the shots. And then I get home and I'm like. Dear, I hear the side of her eye like it's literally coming down at this, and I'm like, oh, [00:06:54] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. [00:06:54] Debbiejean Lemonte: have fixed that in two seconds. [00:06:57] Debbiejean Lemonte: Now I gotta sit in Photoshop for 15 minutes to figure [00:07:00] this out. I absolutely hate Photoshop, by the way. I gotta sit in Photoshop for 15 minutes to fix this thing. I don't want to do it. But yes, most recently, I'll, I'll say we did the session on Saturday or Sunday, and the minute I pulled it up on the camera. [00:07:15] Debbiejean Lemonte: It was steering me in the face. [00:07:16] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Ugh. I feel, I feel your pain. You know, I get, I get in the zone. More often than I probably should because I sh you know, like I, sometimes I miss it, or too often I miss it and it, it drives me insane. And, but at the same time, you're like, you get in that zone and it feels good. You don't wanna get outta the zone, [00:07:37] Debbiejean Lemonte: You're like, you're getting the shots. The pose are working, the composition is doing its thing. The light is, oh. And then you go home and you're like, that damn strand of [00:07:48] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: yeah, yeah. Yep. Yep. Totally. Totally. Ugh. okay, so let's shift to business for a second. [00:07:57] What is one thing that you do for the business that saves you time or money? --- [00:07:57] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: what is one thing you do for your [00:08:00] business that saves you time or money? And let's, let's stay away from Imagen for the time being, 'cause we're gonna get to Imagen later on. But for business, what is one thing you do that saves you time or money? [00:08:11] Debbiejean Lemonte: I automate in my CRM, like [00:08:15] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: which CRM. [00:08:16] Debbiejean Lemonte: I use T or I'm not, I'm not sure if it's pronounced Tve or T [00:08:20] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I think they say Tve, but I don't [00:08:22] Debbiejean Lemonte: I I'm not too, I see the accent on the end. Yeah. I don't, I don't know. I just tve, let's be a little boujee with it. Tve. and with their system, which I find to be, it's robust. But once you've set up your automations, everything just runs smoothly, and so I automate everything I could possibly think of all my emails, my contracts so far, when inquiries come in and the email go back, goes back out, they have a system where people could set up a phone call with me, like everything literally is automated in my CRM because time is money. [00:08:58] Debbiejean Lemonte: I don't want to be [00:09:00] sitting in front of my computer writing the same email. Every day. Why? When my system could just do that for me. [00:09:08] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. Do you have, I'm not sure if Tve offers this like some of the others do, but do you have a, a method in place where you could interject if you need to, to stop that flow? [00:09:17] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yes. Absolutely. often, how often do you find yourself having to interject to the automation? Because I feel like that's a lot of people's fear of automating that type of, part of their workflow is, oh, what if I don't want that email to go out? [00:09:31] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: So, yeah. How often do you find yourself. [00:09:33] Debbiejean Lemonte: I don't think I do it very often because, okay, so I used to do admin support before I even did photography. I am tedious in the brain, and so I literally created an entire client map. Of inquiry down to execution or inquiry to them saying, you know, no, we're not interested and automate it. So that way, again, time is [00:10:00] money and I don't want to be doing these tedious tasks by myself. [00:10:04] Debbiejean Lemonte: Now, if it comes along that, for whatever reason, I get like a wedding inquiry and they throw a wrench in there like, Hey, we're going to have clowns, circus, fireworks, all this other stuff, and.whatever else that's not set in my automation that could like give a run through for the day information that you've shared. [00:10:24] Debbiejean Lemonte: I'll go in and interject, add those notes or whatever, but rarely ever do I ever have to like stop an automation, pause an automation. I've literally sat down, tell my partner this. The other day I sat down and I wrote down the map and I shared the map with them. It's like if a client says no, what are the next steps? [00:10:43] Debbiejean Lemonte: We could say, Hey, we're gonna add you to the newsletter. Hey, this is what we're gonna do. You come up with these steps, so once you automate it, you don't have to think about it. It's almost like you have a personal assistant while you're sleeping. [00:10:56] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: exactly. Yeah. [00:10:57] Debbiejean Lemonte: Mm-Hmm [00:10:58] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yep, yep. [00:11:00] I'm curious if you. We're gonna get to the post session in a little bit, so I'm not, I'm gonna ask this question later once we get there. but it's gonna be related. So, let's go into the next thing, which is editing. Again, not Imagen, right? Let's say pre Imagen or even post Imagen, but, not Imagen. [00:11:16] What is one thing that you do for editing that has saved you time? --- [00:11:16] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: What is one thing you do for the editing that has saved you time? [00:11:20] Debbiejean Lemonte: Ooh. Okay. That's not Imagen. I think the one thing I have done is. Invest in, and, and I'm sure everybody hates AI right now, but invest in an AI culling system. And like you said, I can't mention and Imagen, but you invest in an AI culling situation that learns your patterns. Because for me, I honestly hate culling. [00:11:48] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: mm-Hmm. [00:11:50] Debbiejean Lemonte: I [00:11:50] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I'm right there with you. [00:11:52] Debbiejean Lemonte: I don't like it. Especially when you have your trigger happy, you know, like. In a 30 minute, 45 minute session, you have like a thousand [00:12:00] pictures. Like why, where did that come from? So I'd have to sit through all that. So investing in the AI culling system that would like help you not sit in front of the computer for 24 hours, just break down the system a little bit more. [00:12:14] Debbiejean Lemonte: I think pre Imagen I have a photo mechanic and. It works perfectly fine. Sometimes if I feel like I wanna go back old school and do a little, you know, coloring by myself, especially if it's a small session, I'll do that. But invest, definitely invest in the AI culling [00:12:32] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Cool. Yeah. speaking of AI Culling, so Imagen did come out with Culling Studio, which is amazing. Not only is it a complete, user interface overhaul, but it's also an algorithm update. Big one too. And I put a, a big test through it that completely blew my mind. So, and the accuracy was mind blowing. [00:12:56] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: so check this out. I, about 10 years [00:13:00] ago, photographed a very large commercial job for the originator of a karate school that I have since joined the karate school. It was formed in 1974.unfortunately, the guy who. Hired me to do this past during the pandemic, but not from the pan, not from Covid. the school actually just had his 50th anniversary party, this past weekend. [00:13:22] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: And anyway, so, 10 years ago or so, he hired me to photograph his second photos for his second book that he was writing.and we wound up doing tethered, it was tethered to a computer tethered using Lightroom. So,over 11,000 photos. Okay? Now he's meticulous. So when I say like he wanted, you know, to see a punch, but he wanted to make sure the hand for, for those who are watching the YouTube video, the hand's not like this. [00:13:52] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: It's like this, right? So there's 11,000 frames that he had to go through and figure [00:14:00] out exactly what he wanted for the book. He narrowed it down from around 11,000 to 700 photos. Okay. He did this manually himself. I gave him the photos and he went through one by one. That's how meticulous he was for to know exactly what he wanted in the book. [00:14:17] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Okay? I ran it the same photos through through Imagen's culling studio Studio. No joke, just shy of 700 photos is what Imagen picked. [00:14:26] Debbiejean Lemonte: Oh wow. [00:14:27] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: So it was almost. Perfectly accurate to what the author of this book who created the style of for, of, karate, what exactly what he wanted in the book. That's how good Imagen's Culling Studio is. [00:14:43] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I, I just blew my mind. Blew my [00:14:45] Debbiejean Lemonte: it. It really is good. Like. I've only used it I think once or twice for a large wedding. 'cause I was like, I am not sitting through thousands of photos. So I was like, I'm just gonna run it through. And it was [00:15:00] so good. Like at this point I was like, maybe I should go back to doing large weddings. [00:15:05] Debbiejean Lemonte: But I'm like, no. But was so perfect that it was hard not to mention. It was hard not to think about, maybe I should just use this more, but I was like, I'll do it mostly for the, the larger projects versus like my small graduation minis that I've been doing over the last two weeks. No, but the Cohen system is perfect for these large weddings that I've been doing. [00:15:27] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Amazing. now let's dive into what happens after a session. I'm going to backtrack a little bit. Okay. So you mentioned that business wise you are automating a lot of the tasks that happened, emails and whatnot before you even book. Right? And even potentially, I'm assuming after you book. Right? now my next question, and I'm going to half. I'm gonna add on to this question, but [00:15:52] What is one thing that you do after a session that has increased business? --- [00:15:52] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: what is one thing you do after a session that increases business? And to backtrack and [00:16:00] tie it all together, are you doing things like, Hey, it's been a year since you got married. Congrats on your first anniversary. Is it automated? And how often have you interjected to that because you know people could get [00:16:15] Debbiejean Lemonte: Right. [00:16:18] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: So, I'm sorry that was a whole lot in one question, but, but I'm [00:16:21] Debbiejean Lemonte: you said after a session, I, what do I do [00:16:26] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: To increase business. [00:16:27] Debbiejean Lemonte: to increase business? [00:16:29] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Mm-Hmm [00:16:30] Debbiejean Lemonte: Yeah, honestly speaking, before I even sell the full gallery, sometimes I send them sneak peeks the same day. Thank you. Imagen, sometimes I send them sneak peeks and in that moment they're like, okay, here's my review. [00:16:44] Debbiejean Lemonte: Like they don't even wait to get the full gallery. And once they send that review within that 24, 48 hours, I'll screenshot it, put the photo up on social media or Instagram mostly. Add the review and just share it. I realized that sharing someone's experience with [00:17:00] me so far has increased bookings, especially through social media. [00:17:04] Debbiejean Lemonte: Before, I wasn't booking a lot through social media. I was mostly booking through, word of mouth, previous clients, current clients sharing. Never really, I'll say maybe 10% of my bookings would come through Instagram, so I never really invested much time into it, but it's not when I started sharing reviews. [00:17:24] Debbiejean Lemonte: On that platform, more leads started coming in. Like even yesterday, a lead came in for another graduation session for a young lady, and she's like, I found you on Instagram. Shocker. so yeah, I, I definitely try to do sneaks within like 24, 48 hours, so that way if they give me a review, I could share it immediately on social. [00:17:46] Debbiejean Lemonte: And somehow that gets me more eyes, more awareness and more leads [00:17:50] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. [00:17:51] Debbiejean Lemonte: and. The other part of that question, have I ever had to interject an automation in terms of like the one, [00:18:00] yes, I do automate the one year anniversary thing. I think I've only had to interject once, because life happened with this, this couple, I'm mis life happened with this couple, and I didn't want to trigger the young lady that was involved. [00:18:16] Debbiejean Lemonte: So I was like, I'm just gonna interject and just end the automations. [00:18:19] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. Yeah. [00:18:20] Debbiejean Lemonte: I even went as far as removing them from certain sections of my newsletter. so that way if it's sending out stuff about marriage and couples, it's [00:18:30] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. [00:18:31] Debbiejean Lemonte: again, she's not a part of. I didn't have his email, so he was good. But yeah, I definitely had to interject once because that one was a little messy. [00:18:42] Debbiejean Lemonte: I didn't. [00:18:43] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I just thought of something and I'm wondering if you. I have looked into this, but first of all, do you know if Tve has Zapier integration? [00:18:51] Debbiejean Lemonte: Yes, [00:18:52] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: It does. Okay. So ha are you using ManyChat on Instagram and connecting it to your tve? [00:18:58] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: [00:19:00] no.be something to consider. [00:19:02] Debbiejean Lemonte: I know I see a lot of people doing it. I'm not gonna lie, because I thought about it. I was like, Hmm. Because sometimes people sending me dms when it obviously says Check the link. You know, like that little step, check the link. But I realize sometimes folks just want it immediately. So maybe in integrating many chat might be a thing. [00:19:20] Debbiejean Lemonte: But I also realized I actually love. Being hands-on with my dms, it feels a little bit more personable. It feels like, okay, you're talking to me. There's absolutely nothing wrong. For the folks who are using ManyChat, if you want to use it, by all means, not shaming. Not judging. I think there are parts in my business where I still want to keep human. [00:19:43] Debbiejean Lemonte: I still want that human touch, you [00:19:45] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: well, there's no reason why you couldn't just, again, I'm just spewing food for thought here. There's no reason why you couldn't, start with the human touch, but have ManyChat say, oh, after two weeks now start seeing if the, if you can get them on your list, [00:20:00] you know, and all they have to do is click the button and then there it is, [00:20:04] Debbiejean Lemonte: a smart idea. I might just try it seriously. I might, I might just try it 'cause I'm good besides saving top of money, but I, I've seen a lot of it, but I've seen mostly. Not necessarily in the photography space. I've seen it a lot with like creatives like the, now they have user generated content creators where it's like no face content who do this often, or like creative consults or consult consultants who, who are using it well. [00:20:33] Debbiejean Lemonte: So I might, I might jump on it a little bit, see how it works in the business and if, if it works we'll keep it. I'm a big fan of if it works, keep it and if it don't, get rid of it. [00:20:43] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Have you ever looked, have you ever tried ManyChat at all? I'm just curious. [00:20:47] Debbiejean Lemonte: I just always ended up on the back end as a customer or someone who inquires. Like if I send someone a message like, Hey, X, Y, Z, I get like an automated response and I'm like, I, [00:21:00] that's not what I'm asking. [00:21:02] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I think based on, you know, you and I have just met, right? And I'm just getting to know you, but based on what I've, I, I know about you now. I think you would fall in love with their workflow planner because it very much is that like map it out, post-it notes all over the place and drag lines. It does this, it does this, it does this. [00:21:23] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: That's ManyChat. That's how you set it up. So I, I could see, I could see that being, something that you really like to dig into. [00:21:31] Debbiejean Lemonte: yeah, I might just, if that's how it's working. Absolutely. Absolutely. I'm a big fan of [00:21:37] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: how it's set up. Yeah. Yep. this is now my favorite part of the show. I started doing this in season two, and I've been doing with pretty much every guest, pick a color. [00:21:51] Debbiejean Lemonte: Oh, I'm gonna go with green. Green says money. Let's, let's go green. [00:21:56] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Okay. Sometimes these have nothing to do with money. [00:22:00] These are just random, random questions. I am going to thumb through it and you're gonna tell me when to stop [00:22:06] Debbiejean Lemonte: Okay, [00:22:07] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: whenever you're ready. [00:22:09] Debbiejean Lemonte: stop. [00:22:10] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Okay. [00:22:12] Debbiejean Lemonte: My next question to you is. What instantly makes you not like another person? [00:22:21] Debbiejean Lemonte: Oh oh. Biggest pet peeve, [00:22:26] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Mm-Hmm [00:22:30] Debbiejean Lemonte: like. You meet a stranger and you just have no compassion or grace. Like for me, that's the biggest turnoff my dad has always taught me. Rest in peace, dad. treat everyone like they're the president, whether it's the janitor or the principal or somebody that, that's walking on the street. A homeless person. [00:22:50] Debbiejean Lemonte: Treat them with compassion and respect. So if I ever meet someone, and let's say we're sitting eating and you're rude to the wait staff. I'm never having dinner with you ever again. [00:23:00] Like immediately. If you're someone who's walking on the street and feels the need to belittle, a vagrant, obviously they're already down and out. [00:23:08] Debbiejean Lemonte: You don't need to belittle them anymore. So for me, someone who lacks compassion and respect for other people, it's an immediate turn off. [00:23:17] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: You know, my entire childhood, I had someone in my family that no matter what restaurant you went to, the person was very mean to the waiter or waitress or whoever it might be. And you know, it's family. So it's not like I could just. Avoid the person, you know? and, I still love the person even though the person was not a very nice person. [00:23:43] Debbiejean Lemonte: and it in a way, it taught me, don't ever do this to somebody. And it made me a better person for it, you know? and I think. It's one of those life lessons that just sticks with you, even though you didn't ask for it to begin [00:24:00] with. And, you know, so I, I, I, I I love that. like you gotta be kind, you. The thing is, I feel like a lot of people are mean when they're on this. Pedestal or feel like they're better than everyone else. And it's like, babe, you could meet the person that you were rude to on the way down. So just be kind to everyone. You also don't know what anybody else is going through. [00:24:21] Debbiejean Lemonte: We all live in our own bubbles. Literally everything that happens in our world is a big deal and I get that. But if someone comes to you and say, Hey, can I have a dollar? If you don't have a dollar, you can just say, Hey bud. I don't have a dollar, but I hope you have a good day. Like you don't have to be rude about it. [00:24:41] Debbiejean Lemonte: I've randomly before, been walking from a session one time and I came across a young lady's, it was like 8:00 AM in the morning, sitting on the steps in soho with her daughter in hand begging for money to buy food. And I'm one of these people where. I'm going to check if [00:25:00] you want the money or the food. [00:25:01] Debbiejean Lemonte: 'cause if you're hungry, you're always gonna pick the food. 'cause if you hungry, if you ever been hungry, you're not gonna give up food. And I said to her, I was like, Hey, I don't have cash, but there's a McDonald's around the corner if you want, you both could come and I'll buy you breakfast. And immediately she was like, yes, we'll take it. [00:25:19] Debbiejean Lemonte: And I'm not even sharing this for clout or anything, it's just more so of, I don't know what got her there. But I also know what it's like to come home and be like, wow, I gotta make Ramen noodles tonight. Like I know what it's like not to have a meal meal. So even if it takes five seconds out of your day, be kind to somebody. [00:25:39] Debbiejean Lemonte: Just, it doesn't take a lot, it really doesn't. [00:25:43] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: you're right. I love that. I love that. so this next, part is, this is a deep one. I would like for you to look at your business from a 30,000 foot view down [00:25:56] Debbiejean Lemonte: God. [00:25:58] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: and [00:25:58] Can you share an outlined breakdown of your workflow from lead to delivery? --- [00:25:58] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: share an outline [00:26:00] breakdown. Of your workflow from lead to delivery. Now, I know a lot of it is automated, [00:26:04] Debbiejean Lemonte: Mm-Hmm. [00:26:04] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: but just an outline, bullet list of here's how my workflow looks from the point that the lead comes in to when I deliver the photo to the client. [00:26:13] Debbiejean Lemonte: Okay. I think I'm going to do a condensed version. [00:26:17] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah, [00:26:17] Debbiejean Lemonte: Because like I said, I created this whole map of like, if, if, if, if and when. If and when. Okay. So let's say a lead comes in through my inquiry form or through Instagram, wherever, a message is email they sent out, where they could either book immediately 'cause Tve does this, where you're now able to schedule your sessions with me. [00:26:37] Debbiejean Lemonte: Or bookable events as they call it. so if you wanna book a portrait session with me immediately, you could do that. If you want to book your engagement session, whatever, the only thing that's not bookable is a wedding. 'cause I need to talk to you first. so it gives you the option to either make a call, set up a call with me or book your event. [00:26:56] Debbiejean Lemonte: Once you book the call, we get on the call. [00:27:00] At the end of that call, I give you the option. Are we booking or do you need a minute? After that, they're sent the invoice and the contract again. As soon as they're sent that invoice and contract, that portion is slightly automated. and then about 72 hours, maybe in five days before the shoot, we get on the call again, or I send an email just laying it all out. [00:27:22] Debbiejean Lemonte: Hey, this is what we're doing. If you have any questions. All of that. The day comes, we execute, have fun, but that doesn't stop there for me. Literally the next day they get an email that says, Hey, thank you for giving me the opportunity yesterday.and then kind of lay out what the next steps are. And within three to five days, once they get their gallery, they also decide if, especially if it's a wedding client, they decide if they want to open the gallery on Zoom with. [00:27:53] Debbiejean Lemonte: And we have bubbles, you know, a little drink here and there. and they open, they open the gallery [00:28:00] with me on the Zoom with them. And for me it's more so seeing their reaction and like having that moment with them. Or they could choose to open it by themselves. Either way, once they get their gallery, everything is sent out within four days, they're sent an email just asking for feedback review. [00:28:20] Debbiejean Lemonte: What can we work on? What can we improve on? and then after that, they're just added to a newsletter. So literally the step, there are other intricate steps in between, but that's just the simple layout. It goes from inquiry. We get on the phone from the phone, I send you the contract and the invoice. You sign that baby. [00:28:39] Debbiejean Lemonte: We create a session, execute it the day afterwards, I say thank you. Couple days later, you get your gallery. Once you get your gallery, I then send an email again, just asking you for your feedback and your review. And depending on the feedback and review, I may ask for a phone call for clarification, especially if you feel like you didn't [00:29:00] have a great experience. [00:29:01] Debbiejean Lemonte: and then they're added to the newsletter better. [00:29:04] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I'm curious of the sort of the, well, I'm gonna call it the IPS, the in-person sales part of your gallery re reveal. Right? W were you always doing that or did you add that at some point? I added that within the last year and a half, I believe. since you added it, how have you seen print sales from your gallery? Improve? [00:29:28] Debbiejean Lemonte: they go up. So I'm not sure what most people use for galleries. I use pixie set. I love pixie Set. It's an easy interface. I, I don't like all the extra stuff. And because it's already connected to a printing lab, I don't really have to do anything [00:29:46] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: mm-Hmm. [00:29:47] Debbiejean Lemonte: really. I just send them the gallery and if they want to print, they print. [00:29:50] Debbiejean Lemonte: But I realize whenever we did an unveiling together, whenever I do sneak peeks and let them know like, Hey, you can print from your gallery. [00:30:00] I get print sales immediately. I'm also someone who doesn't do, I know some folks have the model where you have a session fee and then someone buy images. I don't have that model. [00:30:12] Debbiejean Lemonte: for me it's, we have a session. Within your session, there are certain number of images that you receive, and if it's a branding session or portrait session, you get to pick the pictures you want. 'cause at the end of the day, these are yours. if you want to buy extra photos, you absolutely can. And if you want to buy prints. [00:30:30] Debbiejean Lemonte: You could go ahead directly from your gallery. You don't need to sit and talk to me about it. You don't need to cons consult me or anything. You just go and buy the pictures you want, whatever size you want, whenever you want. so yeah, in terms of in-person sales, I've seen it increase since I've started doing the Zoom sessions. [00:30:49] Debbiejean Lemonte: but it doesn't happen all the time. 'cause I've also realized we're kind of in a generation where people don't really care much about print anymore. It's more so of having the digital images [00:31:00] to use whenever and however, [00:31:03] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. yeah, I, it's, it's, it's, it's a thing that I've always struggled with in my area because, besides from the weddings, for the most part, the photographers here are, are just, I.doing galleries and sending it off. So to not do that makes it very hard Right. To, to compete with the, with, with the others. [00:31:21] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: but at the same time, I know, and it's something that I, I wanna work on, is to start doing the IPS for the galleries because I know that it can, it can make you stand out and, and, and increase the sales. So, very, it's very cool that you're doing it. I'm glad it's working well. and it's inspiring for, for me and probably others to. [00:31:40] Debbiejean Lemonte: It's okay to do it though, like, 'cause I even realized when I did the Zoom sessions with, especially the wedding clients, I get a lot of elopements from folks out of the United States who come here to get married. And so sometimes when we do the unveiling, they will end up deciding, Hey, how do we get an album? [00:31:59] Debbiejean Lemonte: [00:32:00] Keep in mind an album is not even in their contract, but now they want to talk album. So it's something to consider of. What human touchpoint can you add to your system or your workflow? That will increase sales at the end? Because at the end of the day, yes, you're providing a service, but when it comes down to it, in addition to having pretty pictures, if they have a great experience, they will throw money at you. [00:32:25] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. Yeah. [00:32:26] Debbiejean Lemonte: It's all about the experience. [00:32:28] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: and, and what, what, are you a fundee. Album designer, or are you a different album designer. [00:32:36] Debbiejean Lemonte: I play around, I'm not even gonna lie, I haven't committed simply because I don't do albums often, to, yeah, I really don't do, I think within the last year I've done three and I've had maybe like 20 weddings, but like three albums, and one of them was a gift to a friend of mine who got married. And I was like, babe, I got the credits. [00:32:59] Debbiejean Lemonte: Let's just get you an [00:33:00] album. so yeah, I'll say I play around, so Fundee's one of the, one of the few that I do use, [00:33:05] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Nice. [00:33:06] Debbiejean Lemonte: black, is it Black Album Renaissance? I haven't used them in a while, but Fundee's the main one I. [00:33:12] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Mm-Hmm. Cool. okay, so we haven't discussed AI yet, so I mean a little bit with the AI calling, but, my next question to you as we get closer to the end of this conversation is, [00:33:25] What does the future of AI in photography look like to you? --- [00:33:25] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: what does the future of AI and photography look like to you? [00:33:33] Debbiejean Lemonte: It looks like, and I'm not even gonna, okay, I'm gonna try to keep it nice because I feel like I could also be potty mouth, AI right now, how it is, I hope it continues that way, where you're just using AI to improve your workflow, improve your editing, improving things first is having AI take over the entire thing, if that makes sense, because then it takes away the human experience from the [00:34:00] thing. [00:34:00] Debbiejean Lemonte: Now I'm just gonna be buying from a robot. I know there are apps out there where you just upload your selfie and they give you a LinkedIn photo. Again, I have no problem with those apps. You gotta be real specific. I think with ai, I would hope it continues the way it's continuing. It continues to improve our businesses, improve our lives. [00:34:26] Debbiejean Lemonte: I am fine as long as it doesn't take over completely. I, I still want us to have human experiences with each other, you know what I mean? Like keep it, keep giving us AI stuff I'm not mad about it saves me time and money, but allow me to also have some control. [00:34:48] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah.that at least I'd Imagen, I can definitely speak for us, that we are about keeping you in complete control with your creativity and just helping, you know, [00:35:00] aid that process along. the whole, the whole upload a selfie thing. I, every time I try it, I'm just like, this is fun. But it's not, it's just fun. [00:35:11] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I, I know, I'm sure, I'm sure there are people who are like, all right, I'll never hire a photographer again. But you know what? That's not, that's not your client. [00:35:19] Debbiejean Lemonte: It's definitely not my client [00:35:22] Debbiejean Lemonte: yeah. I'm in these Facebook groups. and one of them is like a woman empowerment group wants a certification group and somebody came in like, oh, I found this app. And you know, you don't have to hire a photographer for branding photos anymore. You could just upload your, and I was just like, baby girl. [00:35:40] Debbiejean Lemonte: There is so much that goes into branding sessions than just uploading your selfie to an app. If you are strapped for cash, just say that There is nothing wrong with that. Do what you have to do with what you have at this moment. But if you have the resources to invest in yourself and get a creative team to [00:36:00] do your branding session, do that. [00:36:02] Debbiejean Lemonte: Because if you notice even with these apps. Everyone is going to start looking the same. Everyone's gonna start having the same outfits on and the same look like, [00:36:12] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: backgrounds. It's always the same. [00:36:14] Debbiejean Lemonte: always the same. And if you want to look like everybody else, okay, that's fine. Keep doing you sweetheart. But if you actually want to invest in your business and thrive and add some individuality, add some as I call razzle dazzle, invest them in creative team. [00:36:31] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. I love it. I love it. okay. [00:36:36] How did Imagen impact your life? --- [00:36:36] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: How did Imagen impact your life? [00:36:40] Debbiejean Lemonte: Ooh, baby. I can enjoy my summers now.and most people be like, what if you are a wedding photographer? Everybody knows from March to November. You are strapped like you are in every other [00:37:00] weekend, if not every weekend. I remember working with my current mentor, Amy Annais. I am an associate photographer with her, and I remember one year we were booked like from Thursday to Sunday or Friday to Sunday, like every weekend. [00:37:20] Debbiejean Lemonte: I hardly saw my friends that summer. Hardly, but now that I've taken a step back from big weddings and I'm still kind of busy for the summer, I don't spend most of my time sitting in front of the computer editing like I could just call, edit, and have Imagen, do all that work, come back when I'm done having a mimosas or brunch or dinner with my friends and just go through what they have. [00:37:45] Debbiejean Lemonte: I may or may not have to tweak a little bit and send it out the next day. So yes, Deb, right now, Debbie is able to have a life. Thank God I'm able to have a life because of Imagen, and that is not even a [00:38:00] cap. I'm just, I, I have summer plans. I'm not worried about I editing and sending things out. I'm just like, I'm making plans for summer and fall and a year or two ago. [00:38:13] Debbiejean Lemonte: I could even do that. 'cause my mindset was, oh, I shoot today. I gotta make sure I do this. I gotta make sure I do that. Now I gotta Imagen. I'll shoot. Hey girl, what you doing on Sunday? You wanna do something? [00:38:27] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: What, what is your, what is your favorite thing to do over the summer and is it just get together with the friends and drink mimosas? [00:38:33] Debbiejean Lemonte: No, I'm also a, I love doing stuff by myself. [00:38:37] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Mm-Hmm [00:38:38] Debbiejean Lemonte: I don't, I wouldn't consider myself a hermit. I just, I like to do solo things. So I'll probably go do a picnic by a Hoboken, by the Pierre, bring me [00:38:48] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Ooh, I love that [00:38:49] Debbiejean Lemonte: fruit by myself. Or if I want, like today I was planning on doing a solo date situation, self-care day. [00:38:58] Debbiejean Lemonte: Like celebrate this little [00:39:00] interview. You know, I'm gonna go out, do a little midday montey, then go do Taco Tuesday at gringos like. There are gonna be days where I randomly decide I'm just gonna take myself out because I want to. so yeah, I, I'm good. Anywhere food is involved, down for traveling, like I would do a day travel, buy a ticket, go to New Orleans for the day and come back. [00:39:24] Debbiejean Lemonte: I even do maybe walking in Manhattan if I'm in the mood. 'cause Manhattan is a trip.walking. Sometimes I honestly will just go sit by the water just for funsies. water calms me. I'm also picking up a few books that I want to read. Again, Imagen it's helping me sit down and do things that I like because I haven't picked up and read a book in like so long. [00:39:47] Debbiejean Lemonte: I would do audio books or put it up on Spotify, but now I'm able to have a physical book, as you can see, like in the mix, physical books. [00:39:57] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: back there. Yeah. [00:39:58] Debbiejean Lemonte: you. It's heavy too. [00:40:00] I need to get a new one. and now I can pick up books. [00:40:03] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Have you read, Natalie Frank's books, [00:40:05] Debbiejean Lemonte: I think.what's the title of her books? [00:40:09] Debbiejean Lemonte: So she has, built to Belong and Gutsy. No, I've never heard [00:40:13] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I had her on a few episodes ago, so if you haven't listened to that, definitely listen to her episode. and, I, I, I listened to her books. So I, I, I've got, I'm on, about an acre of, of land here. and so I have to. I don't have to, but I chose to have a ride on lawnmower rather than a push mower.and, [00:40:33] Debbiejean Lemonte: a farmer. [00:40:34] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: but like, you know, the, the price difference is dramatic, but at the same time it's, it's talking four hours for me to mow the lawn versus 30 minutes. So,so I listened to Natalie's two books, one summer while I was mowing the lawn. And, anyway, so I, I'm right there with you with reading. [00:40:51] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: It's been a long time since I've. Read a physical book rather than, rather than an audio [00:40:59] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: And I am not even gonna [00:41:00] lie, I'm, I'm into s muddy stuff, so I can't even recommend anything to anybody on this podcast. Sorry guys. the stuff I read is, is, is for like re real, it's for adults. Adults. So, got it. All good. Debbie, it's been a pleasure having you on the, on the show. I'm, I'm, I can't wait for everybody to listen to this, and hopefully be inspired with your detail, throughout your workflow and, and everything. where can listeners learn more about you? Connect with you and of course, see your incredible photography. [00:41:33] Debbiejean Lemonte: feel free. To follow me on Instagram dag images, dag under square images, or you could check out my [email protected]. if you're up for it, I would definitely suggest follow me on Instagram because that's where I put all my shenanigans and stories. I may not post often on feed, but I'm in stories saying all the reckless things. [00:41:56] Debbiejean Lemonte: And maybe the summer there'll be some stories about some books [00:42:00] you've read. [00:42:00] Debbiejean Lemonte: basically. I just might, I just might just throw one in there, just like, Hey guys, check this out. but yes, definitely follow me on Instagram. You can find me on my website. and currently I'm even doing like this thing called study hall with other young photographers who are in different journeys, where we meet every Thursday at 7:00 PM and it's basically kind of like an accountability slash coworking session. [00:42:28] Debbiejean Lemonte: We show up. somebody comes with an issue. If anybody needs help with anything, any help with processes, we help them out. and yeah, so if you're interested in that too, feel free to join. Just send me an email and I got you. [00:42:43] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Amazing. Amazing. Thank you so much. [00:42:45] Debbiejean Lemonte: You are welcome. [00:42:47] [00:43:00]